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kwmoore
02-18-2007, 10:48 PM
This past weekend I visited Todd and Jo and got a chance to fly the Katmai. Great fun--I always enjoy just hanging out in their shop, talking airplanes, and preventing them from getting any work done whatsoever. ;)

Kansas was cold. When my flight arrived at ICT Thursday evening it was 11 degrees F with a 15-20 mph wind. The next morning was 9 degrees when I left the motel at 7:30 am. The night had been clear so the car was covered with dew that had turned to ice. Not frost--ice, like a thin layer of concrete on the windows. It took me 20 minutes to scrape away enough to drive safely. The car's defroster was little help. :eek: I think I like California better. By the end of the day a veritable heat wave had arrived and it "warmed" to the mid 30's. But it was still windy. Sheesh.

Saturday was much nicer (in the 30's again) and the wind diminished throughout the day. Before lunch Todd and I climbed--an apt metaphor for me, considering the height imparted by the bushwheels--into the Katmai to go out to investigate some off-airport landing sites he had found to the north and northeast. The IO-470 started after only 2 or 3 blades and we taxied out for takeoff on runway 33...or so I thought. Todd taxied right past the runway's end into the grass and about 200 feet beyond to the edge of a downslope, where he turned around. In went the power and the bushwheels floated across the rocks and brush as we accelerated. We were airborne below 40 kt just prior to the pavement and then made an immediate right turnout to the northeast.

Todd had a number of jeep trail sites marked as "user waypoints" in the GNS430. Several had cattle grazing nearby so we passed on those--it's considered poor form to spook cattle in ranching country! The first one was on top of a small hill. We approached over a pond, more or less into a ~15 kt headwind, and aimed for a short, sort of straight portion of the trail. Todd brought in 20 degrees flaps and slowed to 45-50 kt. He planted it right on target and braked to a stop well before the end of the straight segment. We couldn't have used more than 100 feet to stop! He then turned left, taxied back over the turf, lined up into the wind and away we went, lifting off well before the curve in the trail. I was surprised by the smooth roll of the bushwheels--in a standard gear airplane I'm sure it would have instead felt like driving 55 mph through a granite quarry in a Yugo.

We did 3 or 4 more such landings. After one we didn't bother to takeoff on the trail, we just had our own little off-roading adventure across the ground--no worries, the tundra tires flinched not at all. The final landing and departure was especially interesting: Todd spied a trail segment on the crown of a hill. The reasonably flat portion on the crown must have been well under 300 feet, with steep dropoffs on both ends. Todd mentoned that he'd first just drag the wheels and decide then whether or not to stop. This we did, and there must have been something he didn't like, because he added power and we blazed off the crown of the hill at the edge of the dropoff, just like a cat shot from a carrier! :eek: What a rush!

We then headed back to EQA, about 25 miles south, flying the entire very sparsely populated route at 500-1000 agl. Todd set up for a landing on 33, then approached high and drifted down towards the final 500 feet of the runway. I knew what was coming and mentally noted what would have been my own "chicken out point," but Todd continued down and landed softly with plenty of room to spare (less than 200 feet). "Still had more than enough room for a touch-and-go," he smiled.

If you ever have the chance for a demo ride with Todd, don't pass up the opportunity. The things this plane can do are astonishing! :o

kwmoore
02-18-2007, 11:34 PM
After lunch the wind had calmed even more, to the 10-15 kt range. Todd invited me to take the left seat. I normally don't fly other people's airplanes, but how could I pass this up? I was somewhat nervous--my most recent 260se time was more than 3 years ago in 812KT--but Todd showed his true fearlessness and encouraged me to start it up and head out.

This was my first experience on the cushy tundra tires, and you really have to anticipate more than with standard gear. The tires are only inflated to 9-10 psi and have kind of a mushy feel by comparison. Taxi slowly and steer with your feet on the floor (minimal or no braking in turns on pavement). A little practice and it was easy to adapt.

I tried to do my pre-takeoff check from three year-old memory and only missed one item: flaps. Todd diplomatically suggested, "Let's use 20 degrees flaps," as I taxied onto the runway. Oops. Right. At any rate, in went the throttle, slowly so I could feel what right rudder was required with the tundra tires, and even before I had applied full throttle Todd indicated that we should rotate, and we were airborne! I did a left overhead departure to the northeast and the Katmai climbed enthusiastically in the turn.

We climbed at a reduced power setting: 23-24" @2450 rpm; nonetheless we were still clocking 900-1000 fpm as we passed through 5000 feet. At 5500 we were in calm air above widely scattered fair weather cumulus, so I did a couple of steep turns, then slowed the plane down to ~60 kt. This took a while, the plane is very clean even with the big tires! At 60 kt I rolled into another steep turn, trimmed and adjusted power for level flight, hands off. The Katmai just kept turning, as though pivoting around a point. When I indicated I was impressed that this could be done so easily, Todd smiled and said "I do these at 48 kt." It didn't seem right not to respond to this challenge, so I trimmed back, reduced power to 13-14" and voila, a 48-50 kt, hands-off steep turn. In either direction. :)

We then flew back to EQA for some touch and goes. On downwind I set 20 degrees flaps and power (16"-17") for what would have given me 65 kt level flight in my 260se's. However at 65 kt the Katmai wanted to climb! I had to back off to about 14" to achieve level flight at 65 kt in this plane. Abeam the numbers I reduced power to ~1500 rpm and dialed in full aft trim. This gave 58-60 kt in the descent through base and onto final. On short final I applied light back pressure to get to 50-55 kt and immediately noticed how stable and easy-to-control the Katmai was at this speed. Coming over the fence I brought in 13-14" mp and settled into a slow motion flare. My touchdowns were nose-high but not at full aft yoke--have to knock off the rust! Landing on the bushwheels really makes you look good. The feeling is not like a "touchdown," rather it's like planting yourself into a soft chair, sort of a "whoosh" as the tires gradually support the plane's weight. One needs to be vigilant about steering during rollout, more so than on standard gear. The low pressure tires do not handle sideloads as well and it can get a little squirrelly. Don't ask me how I know this. :rolleyes:

Impressions? The Katmai is an evolutionary but nonetheless quite significant improvement over its ancestor. Even three years out from my last 260se flight, I immediately noticed that there seems to be a good 5 knots additional cushion at the low end. The plane felt as stable and controllable to me at 45-50 kt as I recalled feeling in 812KT at 55 kt or slightly faster. From all accounts the extended wing does not seem to compromise top-end cruise speed, so one gives up nothing with the Katmai's extended wing while gaining an additional 4-5 kt at the low end. What's not to like? :cool:

Well, there's one thing not to like. It's now going to be much harder to wait the next few months for delivery! ;)

New photos in the "Katmai" (http://www.260sepilots.org/gallery/Katmai!) and "KWMoore's 3rd 260se" (http://www.260sepilots.org/gallery/N812PL) galleries.

nworth
02-19-2007, 02:21 AM
Kevin,

Is this new information? I thought the original plan was to go with the standard wing?

I can tell you that I continue to be astonished by the sense of buoyancy in my ("city-slicker" version) Katmai. Having only ever flown this 260se, I really can't compare it to a "short-wing" version but I can confirm that in 725AS it's almost like the wings have helium in them. At the same time, the overall feeling of the plane is 182 solid. A great combination.

Haven't found any downside to the long-wings except you have to be more careful on the ramp. I was originally concerned that it was going to make crosswind operations more difficult but it may even be that the slightly diminished roll response makes them more stable. We've been having an unusually windy winter for south Florida this year but I haven't had any difficulties at all.

I must say that I still am having difficulty BELIEVING how slow you can go. I do those steep turns you mention at 55 -- just can't believe it's possible to go slower. And, my landings still involve a few more feet of glide two feet above the runway than I really need because I still can't believe it could really be possible to helicopter in, flare and immediately touchdown in the low-40's. Getting there, but it's been a challenge.

Once again, congratulations on the new build. I remember how exciting it was for me to see the plane getting prepped to hang the new engine.

LEVON HOPKINS
02-19-2007, 09:19 AM
Kevin, are you sure you want the original I0460? That Katmai really begs for the higher horsepower and I really want you to have the new engine. If you do decide to take the FULL KATMAI SYSTEM, don't worry, I'll take the other original deal. Considering the over all investment, for only a small percentage more, it just seems a shame not to go the whole way. Oh well. Levon who really wants the original deal bad. Good luck Kevin with the plane. Can hardly wait for the final finished product. Levon

kwmoore
02-19-2007, 09:25 AM
Is this new information? I thought the original plan was to go with the standard wing?
Yes I decided to do this in late January. I was out flying with Rich in his '22 and mentioned that I was pondering whether or not to go for the wing extensions. He had installed them in his T182T and flown with them a while before trading up to the '22 and strongly recommended them.

"Besides," he said, "think of the bragging rights with that 31 kt stall speed."

Done deal. ;)

Now, after the demo flight, I'm very glad I did. IMHO the long wing significantly enhances the 260se's already formidable capability at the low end.

Todd Peterson
02-19-2007, 10:11 AM
It's always nice to know Levon has your best interests at heart. We're just like one big family here.

The short crown on top of the hill that Kevin referred to was something that I would have landed on under normal circumstances. It was less than 300 feet with all sides dropping off sharply. The problem was it was snow covered and I thought our braking would have been marginal at best. We had landed previously on the snow to find it was a mixture of snow and frozen ice. Due to this there was virtually no braking. It seemed to me to be somewhat risky to try this strip with no brakes so I passed on it. As the California Govenator says "I'll be back". The snow cover should be gone in a week or so, that is providing I can find it again. That is sometimes hard to do even with the location in the GPS database.

kwmoore
02-19-2007, 11:04 AM
That Katmai really begs for the higher horsepower and I really want you to have the new engine. If you do decide to take the FULL KATMAI SYSTEM, don't worry, I'll take the other original deal. Considering the over all investment, for only a small percentage more, it just seems a shame not to go the whole way. Oh well. Levon who really wants the original deal bad. Good luck Kevin with the plane. Can hardly wait for the final finished product. Levon
Hey, maybe when the IO-470 reaches TBO I'll decide to up the ante to the IO-550. No worries Levon, at the rate I was flying 812KT, this should only take 6-7 years! Nonetheless I appreciate your concern for my well being and status as a satisfied customer! :) ;) :)

LEVON HOPKINS
02-19-2007, 10:39 PM
Kevin,
No problem AND "no worries." First come, first served is always fair. I do look forward to the photos and the finished product. Levon